Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim

[Ysne58]

The clashing filenames thing wasn't even noticed' date=' because the beta period wasn't long enough to get to this sort of thing. My alt-start mod was going the route of using message boxes a the time (which don't work right either).

I saw the odd behavior occasionally with OCS, but assumed it to have been due to adding it without waiting the necessary 24hrs. So I wasn't aware it was actually a problem during the beta.

Giskard is a jackass, yes, but even utter jackasses can be right. On this issue, he's 100% right. Bethesda has had this bug manifested since Fallout 3 apparently. Which I didn't know, not having done anything that required navmeshing.

As far as not modding Skyrim, we'll miss ya on this side of the fence. Reconsider some day, won't you? [/quote']Certainly typical behavior for the Drama Queen. I really do hope that 1. Beth fixes both issues and 2. Hana reconsiders modding for Skyrim down the road.

[Sigurð Stormhand]

My understanding is that this bug triggers when you revisit a cell, and can be fixed by restarting the game, nasty but not unmanagable.I would have thought the solution was to use an ESM for your interiors in custom cells.Does this affect modded vanilla cells too?On an unrelated topic, I reorganised my office today so that we can hook the monitor up the ariel and have a second TV again, my mother's response?"Why did you put the unit against that wall?"ALL DAY, and I hoovered this room, and my bedroom.Man, I need a better job.

[AndalayBay]

Minor detail: there's no way to create an ESM.

[Dwip]

Wouldn't Smash's ESMify be the solution to that?I wonder if my CK Wiki bookmark is sad that it got placed in my Bookmarks/Morrowind folder along with all the Oblivion bookmarks.I don't suppose we have some sort of master collection of CK bugs somewhere. Caffeine, I needs it.

[Arthmoor]

The bug affects ANY cell, modded vanilla or otherwise.Yes, if you could get the esmification (new word, deal with it) of your mod to stick, you can avoid this issue. That makes continued development of a mod somewhat untenable though because you have to jump through hoops, and it's been found that ESM flagged files that alter vanilla content simply don't do anything. Other than fix the navmesh issue. Cute.Master topic: http://forums.bethsoft.com/topic/1345715-unofficial-creation-kit-bug-list/ - it's an ugly list of ugly problems that didn't exist before. Plus that bit about topic infos isn't there, I should fix that.

[Hana]

Aww, thanks guys. Sorry, but I'm quite content to stay within Oblivion then to deal with the thousands of mountain lions in Skyrim.

[AndalayBay]

The bug affects ANY cell' date=' modded vanilla or otherwise....esmification...Master topic: http://forums.bethsoft.com/topic/1345715-unofficial-creation-kit-bug-list/ - it's an ugly list of ugly problems that didn't exist before. Plus that bit about topic infos isn't there, I should fix that.[/quote']It's got my vote :tongue: I posted that link earlier. :grinning: Arthmoor, how should we proceed? Do we go ahead and start our mods with the hope they'll fix these issues? I would hope that a game with the profile of Skyrim won't allow Beth to ignore these issues. I do have a grave fear of all the mods that are going to be released anyway. A good portion of the issues with tDBC were people running it with poorly written mods.

[Arthmoor]

Mitigate as much as you can when editing vanilla cells, but expect to field problem reports about it until it's fixed. I hate the fact that I've essentially taken a bullet over the navmesh issue at this point, but awareness can't be ignored if you get a wildly popular mod that's broken because of their bugs.If they continue to ignore it though, we're going to be stuck with mods that don't add new cells or new locations to the world. No villages. No large scale quest mods. Not even working house mods. Pretty much anything that requires NPC AI to adapt to the changes will be broken.

[Dwip]

Sad mountain lions are sad.And huh. That would sound as if ESMs are somehow more broken than they were in FO3/FNV, where all the DLCs at the very least added things.

[Arthmoor]

I haven't verified that last part about esm modifications yet. Been focused on taking a stab at fixing my damaged navmesh in the alt-start mod.

[AndalayBay]

Yeah, interesting point about potential DLC's. They'd have to be ESM's to avoid the issue or Beth will have to fix it.

[Thomas Kaira]

FFSThese fucking Papyrus fragments are driving me insane. I try to do something logical like this for a Persuasion option:GetOwningQuest().SetStage(10)DialogueFavorGeneric.Persuade(AKSpeaker)That is a previous script Beth used for the Whiterun gate dialogue that compiled fine, but when I try, noooooooooo. All I get is a complaint about DialogueFavorGeneric being an undefined variable. Which begs the question: how the fuck did Beth manage to compile that previous script? And considering how the persuasion dialogue is set up, how the fuck did they compile ANY of them?

[Arthmoor]

You have to define "DialogueFavorGeneric" as a property in your own script.One of the devs gave a solution for the script filenames collision. In the CK, File->Preferences->Scripts. There's a box there to provide a 4 character script prefix for your script files.

[Thomas Kaira]

Except when I open that menu for my fragment, the "add property" function is greyed out.

[AndalayBay]

You have to define "DialogueFavorGeneric" as a property in your own script.

One of the devs gave a solution for the script filenames collision. In the CK' date=' File->Preferences->Scripts. There's a box there to provide a 4 character script prefix for your script files.[/quote']One down, six to go...

[Arthmoor]

@Thomas: Highlight your script that should be listed in the scripts box. The properties button should light up then. If not, close the window you're in, open it back up, and it should work. Otherwise I'm not sure what you're doing.@AndalayBay: More like 0.5 down. While that prefixing will help prevent you from walking all over someone else's work, it won't prevent you from walking all over your own work.

[Thomas Kaira]

@Thomas: Highlight your script that should be listed in the scripts box. The properties button should light up then. If not' date=' close the window you're in, open it back up, and it should work. Otherwise I'm not sure what you're doing.[/quote']That is exactly what I am doing. The problem is when I get to the Properties window, I can't do anything. all the buttons are greyed out.I've since reduced the script to simply this:GetOwningQuest().SetStage(10)Which I know compiles, but I STILL cannot assign any properties to the fragment script AT ALL.

[Arthmoor]

GetOwningQuest().SetStage(10)

This doesn't require any properties, but yeah, if it's not allowing you to add one, you got me as to why. You can still go to "edit source" and define a property manually.A nice thing I just noticed:

Force Subtitle: If checked, the subtitle for this line will always be displayed, regardless of the user's subtitle settings.

Ooooooooooohhhhhhhh Yeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaahh! Hopefully they haven't fubared and left the display time too short to read this shit

[Dwip]

Ooooooooooohhhhhhhh Yeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaahh!

I see this' date=' and my first thought is *beegee*. Thanks for that moment, Shard.

@AndalayBay: More like 0.5 down. While that prefixing will help prevent you from walking all over someone else's work' date=' it won't prevent you from walking all over your own work.[/quote']Would it not theoretically be possible to modify this on the fly depending on what mod you're working on? Frex, I might do something like AFK1, AFK2, AFK3, etc. Pain in the god damned ass, and god help you if you forget to change it, but...In other news, my first bit of tileset angst as I realize that they modularized the farmhouse inn interior set for basically no reason. Did you want two large rooms on the sides? Two sets of small rooms? A staircase on the other end of the room? Sucks to be you. Totally modular and there's only like 3 possible ways to set up the interior, so modularity gains you nothing. Keep on rocking, Bethesda.[edit] Also, what's this business with messageboxes being busted you keep mentioning?

[Thomas Kaira]

Okay. I think I figured it out.I had to make a fragment that would compile first, then exit out of the topic window entirely, then re-open it, and then the properties window worked.It is going to be a royal pain in the ass if I need to do this every time.

[Arthmoor]

Would it not theoretically be possible to modify this on the fly depending on what mod you're working on? Frex' date=' I might do something like AFK1, AFK2, AFK3, etc. Pain in the god damned ass, and god help you if you forget to change it, but...[/quote']Yes, you could do that. God help you if you forget to switch though and begin blissfully writing up new stuff, compiling it, then finding your old stuff has now vanished

In other news, my first bit of tileset angst as I realize that they modularized the farmhouse inn interior set for basically no reason.

I noticed this as well. Not happy about that personally. I'd rather just plop down a one-piece interior mesh and be done with it.

] Also, what's this business with messageboxes being busted you keep mentioning?

Eh, easiest to explain via example. Beta files, Live Another Life. Install that, then go activate the Mara statue that's lit up over by the door. It will become rather obvious.

I had to make a fragment that would compile first' date=' then exit out of the topic window entirely, then re-open it, and then the properties window worked.It is going to be a royal pain in the ass if I need to do this every time. [/quote']Yep, I guess I should have mentioned that. Yes, you'll need to do that every time. Someone, actually two someone's, already reported that during the beta. Fastest way I figured to do it is to just toss a semi-colon into a fragment slot for a topic, hit compile, close it, then open it back up.

[Thomas Kaira]

Okay, finally got it.The property for the DialogueFavorGeneric thingy needed to be added into the script at the source level, but that finally allowed me to get the damn thing compiled and saved.Just need to set quest stage conditions on the new topics and give them a test.Next topic. This one should be a lot easier now that I have a bit of an idea about script properties now.For those wondering, I am working on removing the main quest requirement from the Civil War questline. I am giving two additional Speech persuasion options (0% failure chance, but will give you Speech XP for using) to the guards so you retain immersion when you get stopped at the gates.

[Dwip]

Eh' date=' easiest to explain via example. Beta files, Live Another Life. Install that, then go activate the Mara statue that's lit up over by the door. It will become rather obvious.[/quote']I'm going to guess that the game hanging on the main menu screen isn't what you had in mind there.

[Arthmoor]

You're getting hangs at the menu screen?!? Oh wait. Fuck me. Unpack the BSA file. Scripts and other things contained within can't override the base vanilla files. Guess it's sort of a good thing you checked it, because, well, this can't go to the Workshop now

[Dwip]

What are we using for BSA unpacking again these days?