Building a Castle...

[Kayle]

So, now that I've decided to split my Horses off from the DLCHorseArmor file itself, and try getting them to work normally, I decided that I might maybe want to build my own little Castle, or maybe just expand on Battlehorn Castle. But I'm not really sure how feasible either really is, at least for me anyway. So I guess I need to just ask my questions and be done with it.If I expand on Battlehorn, by moving the walls out a little bit, expanding the courtyard a teensy bit, and adding some extras (maybe a statue or two), will I need to update the paths of the guards that walk the battlements, or will they update automatically? If no, is there a quick and easy explanation of how to do it? Is it just a simple matter of dragging the bits around and filling the gaps with the same walls? Or am I going to get into the area where I'll need new meshes and textures?

[Dwip]

The big issue with expanding Battlehorn, the exterior bits at least, is that the whole exterior castle is one single mesh. Knocking holes in it is going to be almost prohibitively annoying, although it's technically possible with enough Blender-fu, rage, and caffeine.The good news with respect to building your own is that the castle interior and exterior sets are both pretty robust, and you can do a lot of things with them. Be a fair amount of work to get something you're happy with, but you'll probably learn a lot more in the process than you would expanding Battlehorn. Were it me, I'd start by figuring out a spot I wanted to build at, then play around with creating an exterior, then move on to the interior. You are, of course, in the right place for help with all of that.The technical details behind the Battlehorn patrols are described here. The short answer is that you'd need to move some XMarkerHeadings and mess with pathgrids, but it's not overly hard. The main issue there is that moving persistent objects, which the XMarkers are, is a pain - their position is saved in your savegame, so you'd need to clean save to update, which would wipe out any progress you've made in the Battlehorn DLC.

[Kayle]

Hrm. Yeah, I've already finished all of Battlehorn... So maybe building a new castle is the way to go. I'll have to go exploring sometime and find a place I might like to build a castle.[Edit:] Btw, How does one change the type of an object in the CS, I have an item that is currently clothing, that I'd like to convert to Light Armor instead, but I'd like to do so without rebuilding it from scratch. Is it possible?

[Dwip]

Nope, pretty much you get to recreate it as armor. Kind of annoying, but that's how it is.

[Conner]

Btw, Kayle, do keep in mind that:

The good news with respect to building your own is that the castle interior and exterior sets are both pretty robust' date=' and you can do a lot of things with them. Be a fair amount of work to get something you're happy with[/quote']Is probably a major understatement, especially since Dwip may not be aware that you're an OCD perfectionist... This is one of the reasons I don't even try to do any of my own modding for Oblivion, once I got started I'd never possibly feel like it was really done, let alone good enough for release.

[Kayle]

True enough.

[Arthmoor]

I can personally testify that OCD perfectionists make the best modders. This forum is filled with them

[Dwip]

I can personally testify that OCD perfectionists make the best modders. This forum is filled with them

I don't know what you're talking about...(it really is one of the better sets, to be honest. Not like, you know, the cave set)

[Hana]

(Not me )I would definitely say build your own castle. Starting from something that's already there is ok, but there's much better satisfaction in creating your own idea. There are literally thousands of resources out there you can use to make it unique.Not sure why you're bent on modifying the DLC's to start with, but good luck

[Conner]

I can personally testify that OCD perfectionists make the best modders. This forum is filled with them

Is that what most mud devs and modders have in common?

Not sure why you're bent on modifying the DLC's to start with

Actually, this one sort of puzzled me too, but I figured you must have a reason.

[Kayle]

Not sure why you're bent on modifying the DLC's to start with

Actually' date=' this one sort of puzzled me too, but I figured you must have a reason. [/quote']The main reason is because I'm still learning, and it's easier to learn when you have something already there to learn from.

[Conner]

The main reason is because I'm still learning' date=' and it's easier to learn when you have something already there to learn from.[/quote']Nah, that's MUD mentality, from what these guys say, in this case starting with a blank slate is sometimes easier because you're not having to figure out how to fix meshes and textures and such after you break 'em by trying to make 'em fit around stuff they weren't originally sized for.

[Dwip]

Pretty much what Conner just said. There's all sorts of crazy little things that, IMHO, make modifying Bethesda stuff actually harder than fucking it up on your own. I know when I was just starting out, it was really hard for me to figure out the shortcuts they were taking, among other issues.The need to use existing stuff for reference is, of course, why God created the second CS window.

[Hana]

Well, you have a whole game existing to learn from :lol:Here's a couple of places that will help you;TES Alliance - a small community of learning, you might say. They have an entire forum section called The Enclave filled with tutorial classes on everything from creating your first house, making a model, texturing, scripting, etc with people very willing to help with questions (like we are).The CS Wiki - the same, but different. Not a forum type deal, so no immediate help.

[Dwip]

And of course our own tutorial section, although most of the stuff there is pretty advanced class stuff.The wiki in particular will take you very, very far once you figure out how to look stuff up correctly, especially with scripting, although the tutorials can be somewhat hit or miss.

[Conner]

In fact, if you're really wanting to learn by reading, or at least following tutorials step by step, there's enough stuff around even just cited with links between here and Samson's blog to keep you busy reading for days if you don't bother with pesky sleep breaks...

[Sigurð Stormhand]

(Not me )

I would definitely say build your own castle. Starting from something that's already there is ok' date=' but there's much better satisfaction in creating your own idea. There are literally thousands of resources out there you can use to make it unique.

Not sure why you're bent on modifying the DLC's to start with, but good luck [/quote']QFTBattlehorn in particular will sapp your stength, drain your will and break your sanity when you keep asking:WHY?So, for God's sake don't!Also, I'm already doing it and I have got as far as guard-pathing. :tongue:

[Conner]

So, are you saying he shouldn't do it because it's such a bad idea or because you've already got it covered anyway?

[Arthmoor]

I find this irrational hate of mods to Battlehorn to be a curious thing. Actually I find the irrational hatred of modding for the DLCs in general to be a curious thing.

[Sigurð Stormhand]

The DLC's are just a pain to mod, taking Battlehorn as an example again - it deletes lots of stuff (that we know are a big no-no) and makes pointless land edits, this basically means any subsequent mod based off Battlehorn has to edit five cells west and north of the castle needlessly, thereby reducing compatability.In my case I ended up adding a shed load of stuff to justify all the edits, a whole sodding town in the end.I really should show some shots of this masterwork, shouldn't I?**Some Irony intended.

[Arthmoor]

Actually your daughter mod for the DLC would not require the DLCs dirty edits in order to function. The deletions are an issue, yes, but since they're deleted then you don't really have anything to worry about as far as accidentally using one of the deleted records.It sounds like you're doing something that would be worthy of all that needless editing though. I'm a sucker for good village/town mods and one around Battlehorn would be too cool to pass up.On the note of working with ESPs as masters in general, strongly suggest anyone considering it look into Construction Set Extender. You won't have to worry about that damn de-isolation stuff anymore to work on things like the DLCs.

[Dwip]

What he said. If absolutely nothing else, de-isolation by itself is annoying and beyond the understanding of many.Also when it comes to quests and such, it's much easier to do your own thing than try to tie in to what Bethesda did.

[Sigurð Stormhand]

Actually your daughter mod for the DLC would not require the DLCs dirty edits in order to function. The deletions are an issue' date=' yes, but since they're deleted then you don't really have anything to worry about as far as accidentally using one of the deleted records.[/quote']Simply removing those cells from the Esp causes land tears, you have to work within them and incorporate them. It's a pain.

It sounds like you're doing something that would be worthy of all that needless editing though. I'm a sucker for good village/town mods and one around Battlehorn would be too cool to pass up.

It's called "Hammergate" currently and I hope eventually to have it grow dynamically as you buy castle upgrades, or at least not have specific town developments tied to specific castle upgrades.

On the note of working with ESPs as masters in general, strongly suggest anyone considering it look into Construction Set Extender. You won't have to worry about that damn de-isolation stuff anymore to work on things like the DLCs.

Hmmm, duly noted.

[Arthmoor]

If you removed them and it caused land tears, you either have a mod that conflicts nearby (there are several) or they weren't really dirty land edits after all. I forget just how bad it is, but in any case you still don't have to worry about it in your mod. Anyone who would use it necessarily has Battlehorn as well so they already have the problem regardless of what you do with it.

[Sigurð Stormhand]

Yes, but the difficulty is in tacking what are your own dirty edits and what is battlehorn original, when I removed what I thought were dirty edits I discovered they were actually needed to prevent said land tear. It has to do with the deisolation issue I had a while back.Ultimately, the DLC's a sloppilly created, maily because they ignore questions of incompatability.