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custom player horse suddenly behaves weird


Tasheni

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After implementing all the new dialogue and some quest stages for my followers mod I started to test it from the beginning and without other mods installed. Because player meets Ruby in Helgen Keep I went through the Skyrim intro a thousand times and all was working fine, always.

Surprisingly I had issues this time with dialogue not triggering and some minor things, I could fix. What I can't fix, is the player horse. After player has talked to her, she transforms from a horse player can talk to to a ridable horse. And then she simply walks away to where I have placed her ingame with ck. But there is no AI package that tells her to move away. Instead she should follow the player. I deleted all packages of her and tried again, on a new game, with no effort. I tried to attach a sandbox package either to the alias or directly to the actor, or both. There is no change in her behavior. I deleted the sandbox and follow packages and created them new. Looks like game is not updating my changes (but when I change a script, messages show up right).

Looks like she runs an AI that doesn't exist. How can I find out, what AI is actually running on her? After spending the last two days with going through Helgen Intro to fix all of the issues I would really be glad to find a solution.

I could delete the horse and place it new, but she has so many linked references that this would take an amount of time, too :frantics:

What I simply don't understand is, that the intro with Ruby and the horse behavior got broken, despite I changed nothing on that part and it worked always - with a ton of mods installed or without. How is that possible?

Any suggestions and help is much appreciated.

 

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Hi, Tasheni!  I can only help you by describing a similar type of behavior I observed.  While playing the Gray Cowl of Nocturnal mod, using camels as replacers for the horse (so that the camels were, for all intents and purposes, treated as horses by the game), using Jaxonz Positioner, I accidently clicked on one of the camels and "locked" it in place (much as you would do for a static object).  Subsequently, whenever I would ride that particular camel, once I dismounted, the camel would immediately walk off to return to the the position it was at when it was "locked" in position.  It was as if the default position for that camel had been set, and it would automatically return to it when not being ridden - even though the behavior was that it should follow the player character or wait once the player dismounted (this was with using the mod Immersive Horses) - and this happened regardless of what I tried to do to change it.  I wonder if there is something similar happening with the horse in your game - the position that you set in the CK for the horse is over-riding the following behavior, and that when the player dismounts, instead of following, the horse is returning to its original location as set by the CK.  While not an answer, per se, it may give you some leads to follow up on in determining what is going on.  Am looking forward to hearing more about your inquiries into this and any possible solutions that you may find - if only for purely academic reasons on my part.

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Hey smr1957, thank you for your thoughts.

Long time ago since I played that mod, but I remember: That camel run back to her stable after dismounting. It was quite annoying when I was out in the desert :lmao:

I can't remember if this was fixed by someone. But your suggestion is the only thing that makes sense for me at the moment. Looks like the only way is really to delete the horse and place it into my dummy cell instead in front of Whiterun. This will cut every link in dialogue, script properties, relations I need to relink :crash:. I hope I will find them all.

The horse works like this: She's a companion when player meets her first. Player can talk to her and open her saddlebags. If he want to ride, he can talk to her or use a magical ring to trigger a script. The horse in front of Whiterun gets enabled and moved to player while the companion gets disabled and vice versa with using the ring, if player needs to access the saddlebags or give commands. You can remove the saddle for her to sandbox or ride without tack, tell her to wait or follow.

Alright, then let's get busy :)

 

 

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Update: I deleted the horse, cleaned the mod and then placed the horse into a dummy cell. Then I created the packages new and put them into the alias with quest stage conditions. Now I can again talk to the companion and change her to a ridable horse. Packages are working fine again. But now the script for the magical ring stopped working, so I can't change her back into a companion. I will look into it tomorrow.

Update: I attached that script new to the ring and now all is working like it should. Finally. Now I can go on with what I wanted to do in the first place.

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No, not working, the issue is back. I tried everything I can think of to get that to run again, I even installed Skyrim again to make sure, everything runs well. No other mods are installed. I will describe, how the setup works, maybe I overlooked something.

Player horse Vala is two actors: One ActorTypeNPC and one ActorTypeHorse. They  have aliases in an own quest. The quest handles also the follower mounting, if player mounts his horse. That works fine. The  horse is disabled and located inside a dummy interior cell. The npc is located in the wilderness near Whiterun. When player finds the npc horse, he can talk to her and  open her saddlebags. There he finds a magical ring. Now he can either talk to the npc, if he wants to ride, or use the ring. The ring has a script attached, that disables the npc, enables the horse and teleports it to the player. A script attached to the dialogue does the same. Now he can ride, but not talk to the horse. When he unequips the ring, the script changes the horse back to npc, player  can talk to and reach the inventory.

Both aliasactors have a sandbox package and a follow package attached. A script with a global variable determines, if the actors should follow or not. This is not triggered by the ring, but only through the dialogue. The npc follows, when she should, but not the horse. No matter what I do, the horse refuses to follow. The follow packages are on the aliases, both aliases are set to unique and optional.

Not following is the first issue. The second is: When player rides the horse and hops off, the horse is teleported to the place where player jumped onto her. If player changes her to npc, she is also teleported where player last jumped on her. This happens as soon as the player gets away from her.

What I did to find a solution: Deleted all packages and made them new. Deleted the horse from the world and put it into a dummy cell and relinked every property and references (she has a lot!). Attached packages to the actor, not to the alias. Made sure scripts are triggering correctly. Cleaned manually everything unused stuff with xEDIT.

I can find nothing that overrides the behavior. It worked for years, with a ton of mods  and without mods installed. What happened?

I have a ton of backups, but because I don't know when this issue first appeared, I don't know which backup to use. I made so much progress with the mod that I would not like to do that all again :crash:

So if anyone has a clever idea I would be the happiest woman in the world ;)

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Tasheni, I asked over in the Steam Forums in the Old Farts Coffee House thread (post #71303 ), where a lot of us old time Skyrim hands hang out, if some of the people there can take a look at this and see if they can come up with any ideas.  Hopefully someone will be able to think of something that helps with this issue.

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Oh that's so kind of you, thank you. I asked also in the nexus forums - let's hope someone has an idea. Meanwhile I work on quest implementing. I hope to get that out in december.

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The behavior it seems you are looking for reminds me of Immersive Horses by Sevencardz, where once the player buys a horse, it can have that horse perform several different type of behaviors -  they can dismiss the horse, whereupon it will return to it's default location, they can have the horse wait - where it remains in that specific location until it is either dismissed or it is mounted and ridden again, or the horse can be commanded to follow and will, well, follow the player.  Perhaps taking a look at how Immersive Horses handles these things will give you some insight in how to set things up in your mod.

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I looked into the scripts of Immersive and also Convenient Horses several years ago and they are way too complicated for me to understand. But these mods are designed for every horse ingame, I do only one for the player. I achieved all the same with packages and some simple scripting and it worked like a charm. But I will look again at these mods, maybe I will find a hint what's wrong. I will also take a look at Elhildis' Camel (from Gray Cowl of Nocturnal) I have somewhere on my harddrive.

Weird is, that all the six horses of my followers behave fine, they follow or wait and are never teleported away, only the playerhorse. I will find out. Thanks for your suggestions.

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Good morning, Tasheni!  Some of the group responded back with some suggestions.  See here

Don't know how much help that will be - though you are more than welcome to post in that thread yourself, if you wish - we are always ready to welcome new people!

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Thank you. No, that doesn't help, but they don't know how I did setup the whole thing, I know how to setup regular player horses, did that in my mod Winterhorse replacer. But Vala is special and not for purchase :cool:. I guess there is an issue with the aliases, but I'm just about to track that down. I will report back if I have a solution. I'm pretty sure it's a ck bug.

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Finally I got it to work again. I can't say exactly what happened. I created the horse new in it's own mod. When it worked, I just compared it to my followers mod and changed what was different. The follower quest script had a different sorting of the functions, I replaced it with that working script from the horse mod. And the follow package for the horse must not go on the alias but directly attached to the actor with conditions, and the sandbox package, too. The npc packages are on the alias with conditions. If you change the global values, all packages are affected and it works like a charm again. Puh, that was another day's work to figure out. Now I'm happy :lmao:

  • Haha 2
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Congratulations on getting it all fixed Tasheni!  I knew you would and that it was just a matter of time till your did.  And glad to see that you are happy - that's always good!:celebration:

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:highfive:

Now comes the most difficult part: To get my ambushes to work. I postponed that always, because I'm a scripting noob :imp: Luckyly I was clever enough not to intertwine vanilla quests with mine. With the exception of Ruby's story is involved here, but that needs only dialogue conditions and a few script fragments. And is working already :banana:

To do a simple ambush is not the problem, there are tutorials enough to achieve this. Buuuut... I always try to do things the game isn't made for. So these ambush guys should spy mainly unseen on the player while he is escorting a Dunmer. If they are detected, they should flee instead of fight, until player reaches a certain point, then they should attack. So I will abuse the flee procedure of the deer packages and puzzle that together with other procedures to a new package. I'm really curious if this will work.

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