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Deletions & Archiving at Nexus Mods


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An important notice and our future plans for collections at Nexus mods and community

An amazing WOT of TLDR, good write up, albeit could have been embellished by some nice markup/piccies/graphs as you go.

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How it would work is, using Vortex, someone could build a mod list/mod setup locally on their machine, then export a meta file with all the information about the mods/files/conflict resolution etc. and upload that file to the site. We refer to this list on the site and in Vortex as a "collection". Another user can now add this meta file/this collection from the site to Vortex and Vortex will then fetch all the download links for the mods, download them, and install them in the same way the original user (the “curator” of that mod list) has them installed on their PC - complete with conflict resolution data and all.

In a modding Utopia, for such a setting as one could ever be envisioned, the idea would work beautifully. In our world, a few minor details come into view, like rig setup, OS type and configuration, and mod versioning. And the installed mod manager along with modding tools. Vortex has come some distance since inception, but so have other mod managers. No worries there, as Nexus is providing an API for archiving, so it has to be asked, how interested would the other mod managers be in picking this up?

This looks very much like the system adopted by Wabbajack, with more detail- should work well for folks who just want to play a bundled config. Bit like some with a car, really, one buys a car expressly for the purpose of reaching the desired location with the minimum of "fuss", or one can buy a car to try it out in certain conditions, add or remove components or accessories, go for some scenic touring, or even a world adventure.

I, for one, prefer the current setup at Nexus, the question of archiving files flagged for deletion should be weighted in favour of permission from the mod author, there are sure to be exceptions tp the rule, so this has some distance to travel.

Do you think this is a good idea?

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Hi guys.

Just to say, the mod team are aware of this topic and the "spirited discussion" it has provoked. We're happy to allow people to discuss it here, so long as things remain civil.

Mods and Admins will not be commenting as this is a public forum.

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Personally, I think it is quite sad indeed. I have been a Nexus supporter for almost two decades, hosting dozens of mods with thousands of hours of cumulative work and support, happily earning them advertising revenue all the while. Now to suddenly have them bait and switch their TOS to take away author's rights to license their own content as they see fit, preventing deletion so they can push a paid subscription service to 1-click download 'collections' which basically just take other people's work without permission and siphon user interaction to their own Youtube/Discord/Patreon accounts, leaving mod authors with little more than bug reports, and a 1-month ultimatum to "agree to give up your rights or get out!" is beyond a mere slap in the face, it is shocking.

I cannot in good conscience continue to support them earning revenue off my work when they treat their content creators so poorly. All they would have needed to do is include a choice to opt out of collections on a per-mod basis so users could maintain their intellectual property rights and creative control to delete their own mods. This change takes much from authors, while giving nothing in return but disrespect, and turns the community against them as if no one notices the money grab elephant in the room here!

Furthermore, users that choose to hide or archive their mods will see them still available to these paid-only collections, but free users will no longer have access!

It's paid mods only the actual authors are the only ones not getting paid!

Shameful.

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Regardless of how anybody feels about collections (which I myself am indifferent towards, so long as my mods aren't being repackaged), and regardless of whether you believe in cathedral or parlor modding, many people have made it clear that Nexus Mods' handling of the collections system is both ethically, and legally questionable. I don't want to go into the details of what's been said here, but I wouldn't be surprised if they soon find themselves in hot water with the law, be it from a modder with the resources to sue, or from the developers of the games they host mods for.

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Robin Scott claims that he has a contract, by way of his TOS, which allows him to keep copies of peoples mods, in spite of the authors wishes.   Prior to the change in the TOS, authors were able to terminate their contract with Nexus by deleting their mods.  However, with this change to the TOS, authors are trapped in a contract.  

The great sticking point in all this is that the change to the TOS was done without notification of, or consultation with, Mod authors.  The problem is that the software changes which made copies of our mods were implemented and authors were not told until it was a fete accompli.  And that is the whole problem. 

The issue is NOT mod packs, mod packs is a deflection used by those who favor Robin's action and is a means to bash authors who wish to retain their rights over their mods.  Not is it about cathedral vs parlor, because this change affects authors regardless of which model they choose. 

And for the record, I have deleted all my mods from Nexus Mods.  If you are interested, they are still available on Bethesda.net.

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Software build systems have been doing that for ages where you provide the list of dependencies and URLs and they automatically download them and set up the package so I'm not understanding why people are freaking out about it. I can understand the archiving but the rest I don't get. Isn't it just the same as following a mod tutorial? Not trying to be callous or shallow, I'm legitimately trying to understand why people don't like an automation system with text files. Redistribution is one thing but this is just a set of instructions, or have I misunderstood?

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I can see what mod authors are complaining about and its not the collection they dont like. It the fact that they can’t permenently remove one of there mods from nexus database for what ever reason is not relavent. The argument against removal is that a collection will no longer be stable, my answer to that is bo ho, that is a problem for the collector to solve by rearanging the list or finding a replacement mod. It happens all the time with mod dependancies, or dependancies for Fo4 settlement blue prints. So what has changed that archiving is now suddenly needed, if it was a choise a mod author could make, that would be a different kettle of fish.

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This issue is really awful. I have taken down all my mods from nexus immediately. I got a lot permissions from other users to use assets, sound, music, meshes, voices. Now I'm loosing this little bit of control over my files I had. Of course I know I can't get my content out of the internet anymore, it's shared, for good or bad, but this is not the point. The point is, that nexus does not respect given permissions anymore. If my mod is abused elsewhere, I can do nothing about it. But I'm responsible for the permissions I give and I have to make sure permissions given by others to me are respected as well. An option to remove own mods from a site is essential. A decision wether my mods may be included into a published collection or not is essential. And who decides what mods go into a collection? There will be a preselection and it's for sure that many mods are sorted out. It's like google: You see only what the search engine want to let you see, while other pages and sites vanish into nirvana. Some kind of classifications of mod authors could take place: Only the best for the collections, the most wanted, while others are merely acceptable or too specific for a broader society? Mod users will loose their choices, because many mods will simply be not visible anymore? If you start modding, it's a huge task to search the database for good stuff and time consuming. But does this justify a preselection? Every attempt to make it easier for users is at the same time an incapacitation.

Maybe it's too early to know what nexus really has in mind with this acting. But I don't trust them anymore.

I came from Dark Creations to nexus, now I need a new home for my files again. I spend the last two days with reading through terms of services from different hosters and it looks like AFK is the one. If you like to have me. I trust Arthmoor. I care for privacy as much as possible. I don't want to spend my rare time with obstacles providers throw into my way. I want just to do my work and share it with the comunity. My work and my files are for free and I will make sure they stay free.

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23 minutes ago, Tasheni said:

This issue is really awful. I have taken down all my mods from nexus immediately. I got a lot permissions from other users to use assets, sound, music, meshes, voices. Now I'm loosing this little bit of control over my files I had. Of course I know I can't get my content out of the internet anymore, it's shared, for good or bad, but this is not the point. The point is, that nexus does not respect given permissions anymore. If my mod is abused elsewhere, I can do nothing about it. But I'm responsible for the permissions I give and I have to make sure permissions given by others to me are respected as well. An option to remove own mods from a site is essential. A decision wether my mods may be included into a published collection or not is essential. And who decides what mods go into a collection? There will be a preselection and it's for sure that many mods are sorted out. It's like google: You see only what the search engine want to let you see, while other pages and sites vanish into nirvana. Some kind of classifications of mod authors could take place: Only the best for the collections, the most wanted, while others are merely acceptable or too specific for a broader society? Mod users will loose their choices, because many mods will simply be not visible anymore? If you start modding, it's a huge task to search the database for good stuff and time consuming. But does this justify a preselection? Every attempt to make it easier for users is at the same time an incapacitation.

Maybe it's too early to know what nexus really has in mind with this acting. But I don't trust them anymore.

I came from Dark Creations to nexus, now I need a new home for my files again. I spend the last two days with reading through terms of services from different hosters and it looks like AFK is the one. If you like to have me. I trust Arthmoor. I care for privacy as much as possible. I don't want to spend my rare time with obstacles providers throw into my way. I want just to do my work and share it with the comunity. My work and my files are for free and I will make sure they stay free.

Firstly  welcome, it looks like this site is due a second wave of refugees from another site that has betrayed its members. There are a number of us from the Beth forums forced to find a new home that is not discord. You should fit in well here.

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Thank you. Yes, I noticed your "refugee topic". I'm very careful with what platforms I use and Discord is no option because they sell the content from their users.

I doubt many mod creators will leave nexus, most people will get used to new circumstances and it's a hard decision to loose all of your mod comments and many of your contributors because they won't use another account on another platform. To reach a broader audience nexus was essential. I decided to still be present there, as long as possible, but not with my files. I will announce updates and post screenshots and videos there, but my files must stay elsewhere. I feel the necessity to say no, even if it hurts.

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Nexus TOS is standard of Hosting Websites, CGTrader and many others it's based on Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivatives Creative Commons license if I'm not mistaken. Regardless of TOS as the content creator you have the rights for your IP.
Also I raised a question regarding purchased assets from Artsation/CGTrader which their license explicit says that the Product is non-exclusive, non-transferable and is granted only to the original Buyer. Meaning if a mod is deleted then Nexus cannot share it, but I'm still waiting for an answer to that question. Because if Nexus won't delete the files if they have purchased resources, then I have to delete everything I ever uploaded there lol since I have licenses for everything, Brushes, Materials, Models, MDpatterns, etc.

As for a new platform, I'm kinda everywhere now, I will post mods here, GUNetwork and also GameBanana.
Gamabanana Copywright Policy

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The licenses on GameBanana are set by the submitters and GameBanana claims no ownership over submissions nor does it impose a license.

So I can delete, hide, change, do whatever as I could with Nexus before.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I will probably just post the .esp on Nexus, and link to an external download for the Data.

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Another "refugee" here. My biggest gripe is that they are removing the ability to disassociate myself with their platform in case they do something I don't like. I see that as a huge potential risk, hence I've asked them to delete my mods (I will gradually upload my 4 small mods and modder's resources here).

So I can delete, hide, change, do whatever as I could with Nexus before.


¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I will probably just post the .esp on Nexus, and link to an external download for the Data.

I've got a feeling that that's going to be against their terms of service. Interesting workaround though.

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1 minute ago, Trademark said:

Another "refugee" here. My biggest gripe is that they are removing the ability to disassociate myself with their platform in case they do something I don't like. I see that as a huge potential risk, hence I've asked them to delete my mods (I will gradually upload my 4 small mods and modder's resources here).

 

 

I've got a feeling that that's going to be against their terms of service. Interesting workaround though.

Haha I did not expect it though! I've been a member of Nexus for more than half of my life lol since 2005, I saw the all the changes, but not once I saw compromise from the company.

Anyway, I don't think so, since there are many mods that require external data, or mod dependency, like translations, which are just .esp and need the other files.
Unless Nexus bans the use of external assets, which I reckon is unlikely, also I don't know how are they are going to do with IP of other game companies, like those CODW rips, the MA got the permission for the MA to upload and share, if the MA decides to delete the mod, then Nexus will be sharing it, which they can DMCA Nexus.

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26 minutes ago, Abyssi said:

Haha I did not expect it though! I've been a member of Nexus for more than half of my life lol since 2005, I saw the all the changes, but not once I saw compromise from the company.

It happens everywhere where commercial interests come into play. That's fine, but I don't have to play ball :)

Anyway, I don't think so, since there are many mods that require external data, or mod dependency, like translations, which are just .esp and need the other files.


Unless Nexus bans the use of external assets, which I reckon is unlikely, also I don't know how are they are going to do with IP of other game companies, like those CODW rips, the MA got the permission for the MA to upload and share, if the MA decides to delete the mod, then Nexus will be sharing it, which they can DMCA Nexus.

Good point, I hadn't considered that.

 

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Just noticed some caveats with uploading my mods here: 512mb file size is way too few to get my two big mods hosted. The Isle of Teia has 1,3 GB file size, because I retextured nearly every vanilla asset I used for the mod and included many other resources. Textures are only 1k... Another problem is translations. They are not allowed here, am I right? Oh well, I wanted to finish the update of my followers mod and not bother with organizing things new. If anybody has ideas for a solution, I would be so happy to hear it.

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22 minutes ago, Tasheni said:

Just noticed some caveats with uploading my mods here: 512mb file size is way too few to get my two big mods hosted. The Isle of Teia has 1,3 GB file size, because I retextured nearly every vanilla asset I used for the mod and included many other resources. Textures are only 1k... Another problem is translations. They are not allowed here, am I right? Oh well, I wanted to finish the update of my followers mod and not bother with organizing things new. If anybody has ideas for a solution, I would be so happy to hear it.

Ah we can host here directly? I thought we had to use a hosting website lol
That's what I used, I hosted my files on pCloud and posted the link.

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On 7/4/2021 at 8:44 AM, deaths_soul said:

Software build systems have been doing that for ages where you provide the list of dependencies and URLs and they automatically download them and set up the package so I'm not understanding why people are freaking out about it. I can understand the archiving but the rest I don't get. Isn't it just the same as following a mod tutorial? Not trying to be callous or shallow, I'm legitimately trying to understand why people don't like an automation system with text files. Redistribution is one thing but this is just a set of instructions, or have I misunderstood?

The system went live a few months back, at least, but ToS at Nexus was only updated at the end of June, and the change only announced in July.

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Hey guys Arthmoor, Tasheni and everybody else.

I will not comment or analyze anything since my opinion was expressed and i openly protested, and i'm only making this post because:
It seems that you are not allowed to protest in a civilized way and point out to others "Crucial Subjects" and "Crucial Aspects" of all of this, and awaken them so that they can see where is the rotten tree inside the forest, as well as it's not allowed to try to reach other fellow modders via the "Nexus Personal Messenger" to informed them.
So, all my contact privilege were removed and i can't communicate with anyone in Nexus. I'm not Banned, but silenced !!.

Reasons stated by Nexus:
Spamming mod pages and sending unsolicited PMs to mod authors.

* Spamming mod pages: I only post ONE message to ONE author's mod page that i couldn't reach.

* sending unsolicited PMs to mod authors: Until today i had the impression that was shaped by some discussions with the Nexus stuff about several matters, that Nexus has "No Access To Users Personal Messages" and that they can't look at my page to validate the "Permision" given by another author.... ???? .....????

This is what a dictatorship does to silence people...

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On 7/5/2021 at 11:44 PM, Tasheni said:

Just noticed some caveats with uploading my mods here: 512mb file size is way too few to get my two big mods hosted. The Isle of Teia has 1,3 GB file size, because I retextured nearly every vanilla asset I used for the mod and included many other resources. Textures are only 1k... Another problem is translations. They are not allowed here, am I right? Oh well, I wanted to finish the update of my followers mod and not bother with organizing things new. If anybody has ideas for a solution, I would be so happy to hear it.

Hey Tasheni.


I was going to reply but I just did not manage to do it before i was silenced....

I also have this problem, the mod i've been working it's right now at 1.3 GB, and with this update that it's reaching its final complete version will easily reach 1.5+ GB, (uncompressed is around 4+ GB).
So i'm at a lost of where to go and uploaded it...

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I'm not going to comment on the Nexus part of this, but two of you have expressed concern about file sizes.

Unfortunately the site here is not really fitted to store large amounts of content. The limits set in the upload forms are there to prevent things from getting too far out of control for my current hosting situation to handle. Linode is great, but assigning additional storage is an expensive proposition with them that I'm not currently in a position to expand on. I'd love nothing more than to let you guys upload your stuff here, but multi-gigabyte mod files would chew through the space I have pretty quickly.

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40 minutes ago, Arthmoor said:

I'm not going to comment on the Nexus part of this, but two of you have expressed concern about file sizes.

Unfortunately the site here is not really fitted to store large amounts of content. The limits set in the upload forms are there to prevent things from getting too far out of control for my current hosting situation to handle. Linode is great, but assigning additional storage is an expensive proposition with them that I'm not currently in a position to expand on. I'd love nothing more than to let you guys upload your stuff here, but multi-gigabyte mod files would chew through the space I have pretty quickly.

Hey Arthmoor.

I completely understand your situation and i'm not complaining about it, i knew the issue before coming here.

We need to either find you an 'Investor' or, all of us refugees gather here and give you the money so that you become the "Next Big Thing"!!.

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Calm down, maxarturo, we need to be clearheaded. We can't change what happens on nexus but we still want to do our work and get that out to the comunity.

Thanks, Arthmoor, I'm aware of this problem, too. I have to think about what could be done, but until I have a good idea, I will upload my smaller mods here, if they are welcome. The big ones are WIP and can wait until they are finished - time will tell.

Diskussion on nexus is not finished, yet and some people seem slowly to come to senses and maybe there will be one or the other valuable contribution. I had a visitor on my nexus profile this evening, it was DarkOne, what a surprise. I would give much if I could spy in his head. I mean, from his point of view he follows a trend, that has already started with many platforms offering modpacks and many gamers are happy with it. I assume he's a business man in the first place and one who cares for economic growth. He was not lucky with comunicating his plans, though.

Nexus comunity is so incredible big that it will not hurt him much if a literal handfull of mod creators or supporters vanish. Most people will stay there. And most people will forget soon, I fear. And new users will soon not even know or understand what happend.

Anyway, I will not look back again, I will go on. There will be options to proceed, they have to be found. I go searching :)

 

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@Tasheni.
First of all, hello my lady and nice to see you !.

I'm calm, very calm. My post was not made in anger and was made just to inform others of the current practice followed, plus i'm not the only one that has been silenced. And i'll not analyze further the Nexus issue here, it's was one post and the last about it.


But why not gather here and help this site take the next step ?, does this sound a so impossible task ?, if you ask me, no it isn't.

100 euros by a 100 modders is 10000 euros.

And i personally have absolutely no problem in supporting this site as long as it needs, and we are all together in this.

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@Tasheni.
I have bad news for you... You said:
"Discussion on nexus is not finished, yet and some people seem slowly to come to senses and maybe there will be one or the other valuable contribution..."

* You can find it in the post: General Mod Author Discussion > What is happening in the modding community?

post-4730224-0-27129700-1625622623.jpg

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9 minutes ago, maxarturo said:

@Tasheni.
I have bad news for you... You said:
"Discussion on nexus is not finished, yet and some people seem slowly to come to senses and maybe there will be one or the other valuable contribution..."

* You can find it in the post: General Mod Author Discussion > What is happening in the modding community?

post-4730224-0-27129700-1625622623.jpg

I expected that, I haven't seen Dark0ne make a compromise for the community, not once, maybe there was? I certainly can't remember.

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