Mod Theft and Steam Workshop

[Arthmoor]

Recently it was brought to the attention of Nexus users that some illegally uploaded mods were present on the Steam Workshop (SW) for Skyrim. These mods have been lifted directly from their Nexus entries and uploaded to SW without any permission being obtained from the authors whatsoever. Discussion flowed on what to do about this problem, who to contact, how far to take things, and in general how the community was going to respond to SW in general because of this.

The root problem is absolutely NOT the fault of the victims, as at least one person in the discussion had the audacity to suggest. The fault lies with Valve, and to a lesser extent, Bethesda, for not having adequate systems in place to moderate the uploads. I will grant that SW is a new service which still needs to have some kinks worked out. That's understandable. However both of these companies are leading figures in the game modding community and they should have anticipated this problem long before launch day.

Originally, the report button on the site simply sent a flag to... who knows where. No way to tell them why you were reporting, so whoever may have been handling that would be left with no clue what the problem was. That did eventually change so that you can now describe the issue, but those reports appear to be vanishing into a black hole never to be seen again judging by how slowly they get handled when left to just that device. One can therefore see how this sort of environment is a breeding ground for illegally hosted content.

The first and probably most egregious case was a user who uploaded something in the area of 30-40 packs of weapons and armors ripped straight out of Morrowind and Oblivion. The guy didn't even bother to try and disguise it. He openly mocked those who reported it, at first, then simply resorted to deleting the posts of everyone who was pointing out the theft. Several community members rose to the occasion and used the report feature on every last entry - to no avail. Nearly two months later the entries were still up and only repeated PM's to Matt Grandstaff (GStaff), the Bethesda forum coordinator, resulted in something finally being done by it. The reason it took so long? Valve had taken away GStaff's access to the system!

The second case, more recently, was a user going by the name of Buckles. This user had appropriated for themselves a number of mesh and texture mods from someone on Nexus going by the name Jojjo. This theft was pointed out, Buckles reacted as all thieves do by covering up the evidence. Then once more, as most arrogant idiots also do, changed the mod's description entry to openly mock Jojjo's work and defiantly stating he would not be taking it down. As a result, Jojjo has now pulled up stakes and left the modding community ENTIRELY. Nearly a week later, the stolen mods were removed mysteriously. Nobody knows if it was Valve who pulled them or if Buckles panicked and realized he was about to get banned. One small victory, but at the cost of a very talented modder who will no longer be producing work for others to enjoy. Nice job Buckles, hope you're proud of yourself.

Another user by the name of Ralof (oh, the originality of it all) had some stolen work put up as well and quickly took it down after being exposed. Again, likely because he realized he was about to get banned. The same with a few other things.

So why the hell am I suddenly so invested in this? As you might guess, I am now the latest victim of this where not one, but two people have posted stolen versions of Open Cities Skyrim for no valid reason. Sure, Yo-Landi (aka Bonehenge on the official Bethesda forums) will tell you it was perfectly logical. She'll even lie to your face and tell you she asked all nice and sweet and politely if I'd remove a feature I've added to the mod's re-released update. She'll lie to your face and tell you I flew off the handle in a wild rage immediately and without provocation at the mere thought of defiling the mod. The reality is almost entirely opposite to that.

The background on this specific case isn't anything special either. I added some leftover Oblivion gates to the cities as an homage to TES4 and as a nod to lore which strongly suggests that such remnants would remain. Not only in the cities but scattered all over Tamriel. Hana was kind enough to fulfill the resource request for the meshes and textures. I placed two in Whiterun, and one each in Markarth, Solitude, and Riften. Each one is fitting for the area it's in and aside from the reddish colored one in Whiterun, they don't stand out too much.

"Criticism" came swift and sure from dozens of people who came out of nowhere with scathing insults and personal attacks. "You ruined the mod", "this is a big piece of shit", "I found a bug: There's a donut hole in Whiterun", "you're an asshole for doing this", "YOU BROKE MY GAME" (yes, someone actually claimed that). The attack started not in the place you might expect, but on Nexus of all places, where such displays of insulting outrage result in insta-bans from the site. I can only confirm two who got themselves booted as a result before I asked the moderators to lock the comment thread for the mod. The rest apparently escaped punishment.

The next most unlikely source was from Yo-Landi, the thief who stole the mod. Going by the name Bonehenge on the official forums, she had the audacity to post directly in my official support thread for the mod that the gates were shitty and that she was taking it upon herself to "fix the bug" and proceeded to throw up a link to a warez site she found to store it on. Fortunately the reaction there was swift and sure - from a heap of supportive modders who torched her for the flagrant violation of rights on display. The forum moderators had to be brought in to clean up the mess.

Unable to sustain the assaults on Nexus and BGS anymore, Yo-Landi has taken her fight to the Steam Workshop, which is where my rather direct involvement in this started in earnest. She has posted a blatant rip off of the mod, doing only one thing. Removing the gates. No regard for copyright, modders' etiquette, or even the rules that both Bethesda and Valve have in place governing the Steam Workshop. This was pointed out to her of course, but she has steadfastly refused to acknowledge directly violating the site rules and the EULA governing the CK. She'll go on about how *I* am the unhinged arrogant slob and how *I* ruined everything and *SHE* is coming to everyone's rescue to provide a *PROPER* version of the mod that doesn't violate lore. This person wouldn't know the lore if it walked up and bit her on the ass.

She's been reported. GStaff has been told, a number of her supporters who are not surprisingly all Nexus users who got shut out when the thread was locked showed up to defend her. I can tell that they all know what they did is wrong and they're just puffing up to look tough on the internet, but that's not going to save them when the hammer falls after the entry is removed - and it will be - the only question is how long I'll have to wait to see it happen. The outcome of this is going to determine where I stand on continuing to use (or not use) the Steam Workshop in the future.

Now, as if this entire long-winded dramafest wasn't already strange enough, the most unlikely of unlikely people has risen to stand WITH me on the subject of stolen mods. Have a seat, you probably won't believe it. Giskard. Yes, someone most of us consider an enemy of the community. Someone whose own actions have met or exceeded some of the very same theatrics of the day. Giskard has not only stood in support of my situation but in support of all the modders who are being ripped off on SW. The two of us clearly do not agree on a lot of things, but I'll say openly that I am glad to have his support on this. He's even offered a contact inside Valve to utilize to try and expedite the removal of my stolen content. Unfortunately I can't yet contact that person because whoever is running the show on their discussion forums is asleep at the wheel and hasn't cleared my account to use the PM system.

So what's to be done about it? Well, one of the only suggestions to be brought forth so far involves the appointment of some trusted community members to act as a line of first defense. Someone to act on initial reports of stolen content or whatever else. These people would be given the ability to flag an entry as hidden for further review by either Valve or Bethesda for final disposition. In no way would I ever advocate that community members alone have the power to wipe out an entry without oversight.

Aside from this, awareness needs to be raised. The issue is more widespread that it appears right now because investigating SW for stolen content only just got to a coordinated level, and has only had limited success thus far. Valve and Bethesda both need to be told the Workshop is in disarray and needs more strict oversight. Not just to protect us as modders, but to protect them as well since people are also uploading nude mods and child killer mods, both of which are expressly forbidden by Bethesda.

Some further reading material for the subject:

EULA for the CK/GECK/CS
Copyright Myths
More Copyright Myths
Bethesda's official stance on assets ported from other games, including their own.
Bethesda's instructions on how to report stolen content

[Arthmoor]

[This was split from the OCS release thread here since this drifted well off topic for that]No, it was a whole mess of different people who clearly did not pay attention in their etiquette class. If they even had one. Haters may hate, trolls may troll, but I need not put up with either and if locking the thread brings sanity back to things then so be it. The only other option was nuclear - removing the mod from the site entirely.Yes, people whined a bit about the flags, but it never EVER got this bad. Also, people were much more polite about it when they asked for ways to get rid of it, and readily accepted it when I said I wasn't going to. Which eventually led to someone politely asking if they could put up a patch mod to remove the flags, and I said that was fine so long as it remained a patch mod dependent on the original.Rudely demanding the removal of the gates for groundless reasons was not the way to go about this.

[Thomas Kaira]

Yes' date=' people whined a bit about the flags, but it never EVER got this bad. Also, people were much more polite about it when they asked for ways to get rid of it, and readily accepted it when I said I wasn't going to. Which eventually led to someone politely asking if they could put up a patch mod to remove the flags, and I said that was fine so long as it remained a patch mod dependent on the original.[/quote']On that topic, if you are willing, I could draw up a quick "No Gates" plugin for OCS. Following all your rules, of course (I know how to make a patch mod, after all).Only if you are willing, of course. I know now is rather early on and you are still reeling from the popular response to this, but I'd rather get the patch sorted now before people start flooding the web with unsanctioned redistributions of this mod just to remove the gates (two people have attempted this so far).

[Arthmoor]

Two people? I only saw the one, I guess that's a good thing because I'm still rather pissed off about this whole thing and that might have been enough to get me to lock the BGS thread out.Let me think on the no gates thing. I'm in no mood to be deciding on that right now.

[Thomas Kaira]

It was actually someone on the Nexus comments (which means that if you saw that, it would probably have prompted you to take the mod off Nexus entirely instead of just shutting down the comments). Don't bother looking, the comment has already been deleted.

[Arthmoor]

Entirely possible, though not without a stop to report them for mod piracy first.

[Arthmoor]

Well there's apparently at least one person who thinks I'm the equivalent of Bashar Assad for having put gates in the cities. Only further proving of course that the Skyrim community is simply NOT a friendly one the way Oblivion's community is.(Hint guy if you're reading: It's my blog, and a topic on the Syrian Civil War is not the place to have this discussion - you will be marked as a spammer if you keep it up)

[Thomas Kaira]

Bah! He's got it all wrong. Here, we either go Hitler or go home!

[Arthmoor]

Well his comment was mildly amusing in that he said Assad is cracking down on the rebels because they tried to build Oblivion gates in Syria.The further irony of all this noise is that so far the only two people to openly complain turned out to both be Nexus users trying to get around the thread lock on Nexus. They forgot that AUTHORS have control on SW and it took all of a couple of seconds to put and end to it.Even more amusing when the weak ass argument is that this is "feature creep". Yes. So is adding gatesmen who will spare you having to dismount your horse to get into the city. I didn't see anyone complaining about that.

[Dwip]

I think this is where I'm supposed to say something about gatesmen being the gateway drug by which the rebels will build Oblivion gates to unleash the Americans into Syria.That or run around screaming "GATES! GATES EVERYWHERE!" at the top of my lungs while waving my arms in the air. One of those.

[Arthmoor]

*slays some rabbits outside Riften* Oh yeah Mr. Rabbit God? Where are your worshipers NOW?

[Dwip]

Strike us down and we shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine!

[AndalayBay]

No, that is not Photoshopped - it's a mask. And that would be one Ibsen's Ghost. :biggrin:

[Thomas Kaira]

Two more unsanctioned gate patches for the mod: here and here.As predicted, this is getting way out of hand.

[AndalayBay]

I reported the mod uploaded to Steam Workshop to Gstaff. I don't think that's a patch - I think it's the entire mod.I sent a PM to Gstaff about it. I notice that when you click the report button on SW, it's for stuff that violates Steam's terms of service, not Bethesda's, so I didn't bother using report.Since I sent the PM to Gstaff, I was hesitant to report those posts, but I think they should be. Could someone report the posts with the links as well as that asshole bonehedge again?

[Arthmoor]

It is the entire mod. Reported to Steam, and PM'd to GStaff. Bonehenge == Yo-Landi. Gave herself away with that filesmelt.com link.Thingy Person knows better, I'll approach him on the side first.Then again it looks like one of you may have beaten me to it - he hid the file.

[Arthmoor]

*chuckle* The enemy of my enemy.... of all people who have stood up to side with me on this, Giskard. Honestly not sure what to make of it, but he's even given me some contacts he has inside Valve to try and deal with this shitstorm.

[Ysne58]

*chuckle* The enemy of my enemy.... of all people who have stood up to side with me on this' date=' Giskard. Honestly not sure what to make of it, but he's even given me some contacts he has inside Valve to try and deal with this shitstorm.[/quote']I'm not sure what to make of that either.

[AndalayBay]

What the flying fuck? Hmmm... Maybe being ostracized by the whole community is having an effect?In terms of TP, I was surprised he did it in the first place. I didn't say anything - perhaps he realized his goof on his own.

[AndalayBay]

Just joined the fray on SW. I posted in that asshole's thread:

Bethesda's EULA only covers their material. Anything made by modders is protected by copyright. That's fine. Self entitled little bastards like you keep stealing our hard work, we'll just stop publishing. Then you won't have anything to steal anymore.Quite a modding repertoire you've got here. One stolen mod. Nice work loser.

I have no intention of ever using SW.

[Arthmoor]

Well it's pretty clear that as a potential protective measure it has no effect. I'll wait and see what I get back from Valve and/or BGS before I decide. It would certainly be prime motivation to deliberately package things in such a way as to require a master dependency that the Workshop would then be unable to host. Could be just the excuse I need to start assembling my resource ESM I intended to start using for my villages. Enough dependency on that and nobody would be able to effectively separate it into an uploadable form without knowing WTF they're doing - and as I see it those who know WTF they're doing are not inclined to risk getting their accounts banned over it.I did PM TP, but by the time I had, the patch had been pulled. Nexus is probably on high alert for stuff like that right now anyway and he shouldn't risk getting himself banned over it.It DOES appear I've managed to stamp out those who were making a mess of my comments thread though. So I will give Valve props on giving authors far more effective controls than even Nexus has.

[AndalayBay]

Yeah... I don't like Steam anyway, so I just won't bother.Our downloads area is open right now. I'm wondering if we should close it off to members only.

[Hana]

Just getting caught up.... all I can say is What is wrong with people?

[AndalayBay]

That thread on that guy's upload page on SW is just sickening. I hope Gstaff steps up and pulls it down. Both Arthmoor and I have PM'd him.Although having Giskard side with Arthmoor was truly priceless. Giskard had to make sure people knew he and Arthmoor were enemies though!

[Thomas Kaira]

I'm not getting involved in the SW melee. I've already had two posts removed on BGS trying to explain to our epic dumbass why he/she is dead wrong, but of course, he/she is having none of it. Now he/she is on my ignore list, I don't want to go through that dance a third time.