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Giskard and False Accusations


Arthmoor

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In Giskard's OMG, one of the things that happens after you become arch-mage one of the things that happens is the arcane university is completely remodeled, so this could be what he was refering to. I'm not sure which version he started that in, though. He also makes it two different guilds, one for magical law enforcement - the other for magical education. Essentially, your character is head of the legal part. (Which explains why you have time to go to every cave in Cyrodiil looking for illegal magic users :P ) Anyway, your really not [i] supposed [/i] to upload anything related to Giskard on Nexus (per DarkOne), so Reaper's better off with it removed. Come to think about it, your not supposed to talk about Giskard or his work on Nexus either; but lately, you can get away with a passing comment once in a great while.
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Those features are from OMG v7+, Reaper only found v6 online when he provided the tweaked ESP (it's been there more than half a year without anybody complaining, just people happily benefitting from the ability to use both mods together).
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If that's the case, why are we bitching about it now? Why not 3 months ago, or next week? Plus, I believe Giskard has renounced v6 anyway; so basically, complaining about it now falls under "moot point".
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Tell that to Giskard since he's the one who sent his minions to raise hell for Reaper over a total non-issue. I'd be half tempted to write the guy a patch that doesn't involve having to use a modified copy of OMG just to shut Giskard's gang up once and for all.
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Giskard doesn't care that he renounced it, the mere fact that Reaper did something to a mod with his name on it was met with an automatic RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! response. Eventually he has a rage overload and rage-quits, but as we all know he has a rather frugal definition of the word "forever." He doesn't give a shit what he bitches about, he doesn't even give a shit about his own opinions.
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I think the whole mantle of 'all the other Oblivion modders are ripping me off' and 'I have to shut down again because of the viscous attacks on my site' is probably one of the things he uses to keep his devotees from finding out that the wider community is actually quite a nice place. And since there aren't any attacks on his website or mods, he has to 'invent' attacks to keep his followers from realizing that the rest of the community is leaving him well enough alone and aren't actually a bunch of trolls attacking him all the time. Perhaps calling it a proxy war would be apt (except of course only one side is actually fighting it and the other either laughs or doesn't even know it is going on).
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Well, yes. (This even though many Guildmembers are [i]also[/i] Nexus/Bethforum/Alliance members) The fact that these three forums explicity or by mutual agreement either forbid, discourage, or curtail the discussion of Giskard and his works, does make it a fairly one sided discussion. I believe that was one of the reasons Samson started this thread in the first place. Anyway, as it is, Giskard can make any accusation he likes on his forum, and those he accuses have no forum from which to defend themselves: to wit, if they register and try to defend themselves on his forum- they are banned for being trolls. If they try to defend themselves *elsewhere* they are at the very least given a staff reprimand for bringing up "he that shall not be named." It's rather unfortunate (or fortunate, depending on your side of the table) that those guildmembers that are also in other groups don't check for themselves whether the accusations are true. Oh, btw: re-read the OP. Actually, you don't have to be in the same room to slander someone. Basically, if you SAY it, it's slander. If you WRITE it, it's libel. In this case, even if everything Samson said was utter bollocks, neither would apply because a) it falls under the category of "personal opinion", b) both imply KNOWINGLY making a false declaration that is LIKELY to cause harm. (Since no measurable harm can conceivably befall Giskard because of this...) [draw your own conclusion
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Giskard sees ESPs dependent on his ESPs as a breach of his copyrights (probably because he doesn't know how to make an ESP dependent on another ESP, so it must be Evil Magic). So making a patch which edits things relating to his mods is still viewed as uploading his own mod content. Which has never stopped me, as I don't agree with this view. I see an ESP dependent on another ESP as free to make any edits it wants to that other ESP, as the original ESP remains untouched and only available from the original mod author. [quote=dallen68] I believe that was one of the reasons Samson started this thread in the first place. Anyway, as it is, Giskard can make any accusation he likes on his forum, and those he accuses have no forum from which to defend themselves: to wit, if they register and try to defend themselves on his forum- they are banned for being trolls. If they try to defend themselves *elsewhere* they are at the very least given a staff reprimand for bringing up "he that shall not be named."[/quote] Quite correct. It was partly following my exasperation at the way Giskard had free reign to post any lies and insults he wanted on his on site, while those he was attacking had nowhere to post responses as attempting to do so on the popular forums resulted in your posts being deleted. When I mentioned this to Arthmoor once via PM, he mentioned that he'd had enough of Giskard's attacks too, and so did the noble thing and made use of his own webspace to allow us to respond.
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  • 4 weeks later...
  • 4 weeks later...
[url=http://www.theengineeringguild.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=114:all-boss-users-important-warning&catid=7&Itemid=101]Someone just doesn't know when to give it up.[/url] Folks should realize by now that not only are the terms "diry" and "mod cleaning" correct, they are 100% applicable to what he's ranting about now. BOSS is vetted by numerous people, not just by those of us on the admin team. The information is entirely correct, and NOT following it is far more likely to cause you problems than following it is. BOSS is also not advising anyone to make direct edits to anything. This is another one of his disguised rants against TES4Edit, which is an entirely safe utility to use for the purpose of cleaning up after the CS. It is also not a violation of his "license" since nobody is advocating that corrected versions of his files be offered for download anywhere. Copyright law gives you the right to modify files for personal use. The only troll here today is Giskard. Giskard, if people are coming to you to fix your broken shit, we're going to continue to send them to you as only YOU can fix this the right way rather than continuously offloading your responsibility onto others. BOSS will continue to give proper information.
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His new [url=http://www.theengineeringguild.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=115:beths-modding-system-101&catid=22:the-blog&Itemid=117]Beths Modding System 101[/url] is equally inaccurate and showing his ignorance. He still hasn't grasped the actual meaning of dirty edits and the outcome from mod cleaning, he thinks that cleaning a mod of dirty edits means removing any records which conflict with another mod (i.e. edited vanilla records in two mods - a dirty record is an unedited vanilla record in a mod, not an edited record). And he still hasn't learnt about the ability for ESPs to edit ESPs, claiming that this is impossible due to hard-coding: [quote]Beths official modding tool, known as the construction set and GECK make the ESPs that are our mods. But there is a hardcoded rule that says one ESP cannot talk to another ESP. So one mod cannot tell another mod what is going on.[/quote] If it were hard-coded, then it would not be possible to have ESPs with ESPs as masters, yet there are so many mods which have this, so clearly it is not hard-coded. [quote]So we turn our attention back to the play ground and look for ways to do the same thing. Whilst playing in the nice safe play ground we spot a default stone that all mods can see even though they cannot speak to each directly. So we move the stone 2 feet to left. All other mods can see that stone has moved so we have found a way to communicate between ESPS. Of course some idiot mods cleaner then comes along and sees we moved a harmless stone and calls it a dirty edit and undoes the edit, effectively breaking our mods, corrupting your saved games whilst telling everybody they are experts and know what they are talking about.[/quote] He's talking about that rock he owns again, now a stone. And wrong again, if you moved it, it's not a dirty edit is it, because it's been [i]moved[/i]. Also, for another mod to detect that moved rock, it would need to be persistent and given an editor ID so that a script can be run to find it and check its coordinates (easier to just disable it rather than move it, but if you like scripts, go with it). [quote]From a players perfective, it can be as simple as knowing Janix's "Fighters Guild United" works great with my "Fighters Guild Contacts" mod. Until somebody moves something using a patch or clean something and stops them working together.[/quote] Why would anyone create a patch for two mods which don't actually conflict? Patches exist to enable to conflicting mods to work together, not to make two working mods not work together. [quote]Of course some mods will always conflict but in those cases you just chose 1 and dump the other. That is Beths way of saying these mods are too dangerous to work together, do not even try to use them both at the same time.[/quote] True. Unless of course there's a patch to make them work together. [quote]Only a fool ignores a warning from the official game developer after that hardcoded limits in to their games designed to keep our games nice and stable. [/quote] Only a fool insists on only using what is provided and never striving to make things better. Imagine if the creators of cars had done that with carriages, we'd all still be riding around in horse-drawn carts because that's what the cart-designers came up with so nothing should be attempted to change that (then again, the pollution would be lower without cars...)
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Every time he posts something like that it reminds me of just how much damage his community isolation has done. Mainly to himself and those who follow him. Occasionally to the rest of us who have realized Bethesda's "playground" was actually a playpen we've all long since outgrown. But then you read stuff about how tools can remove edits, and it belies a truth he'll never admit: He knows how they work and what they do because he himself has clearly been forced to use them in his own work to correct his own mistakes that the CS/GECK cannot correct on their own. Or perhaps he's a split personality, because this whole business of rocks talking to each other (barring tricks only possible through use of said tools) sounds like something only a crazy person would think of.
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[url=http://www.theengineeringguild.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=119:tools-and-mod-cleaning&catid=22:the-blog&Itemid=117]Tools, Mod Cleaning, Learning to Mod[/url], Blah, blah, blah, *yawn* blah, blah. I actually wasn't able to read more than a third of this before losing interest, it is entirely a rehash of the usual rubbish. I did notice however that he quite clearly refers to himself with pride as a whore, which surprised me. There's also an attempt at comparing modding to a vehicle engine, however it was a poor analogy as the comparison didn't match up to the point he was trying to make. Someone with no knowledge of engines removing one nut from an engine and asking if it's okay to remove it is not the same as someone following directions on how to remove one corrupt record from a mod and discovering that the crash they'd been experiencing has been fixed. The big differences being that for the mod, the person was following directions from someone who knew what to do to resolve; a backup of the mod can be used if the record removal didn't help (while an buggered engine from the removal of a nut is not so harmlessly and swiftly undoable); and the corrupt record was being removed for a specifc reason, to fix a game-crash, while his engine nut removal was not given any explainable reason for being removed. Failed analogy, try again. Here's a better one: Someone following directions to check and refill the oil in their car, using a dip-stick they bought from a garage (rather than the built-in dip-stick which came with the vehicle) and then using a funnel to pour the oil in rather than just pouring straight in and hoping you don't splash. Tools used which didn't come with the car and thus according to Giskard are unsafe and likely to break the vehicle: funnel and dip-stick. Result: oil is refilled without splashing any onto other parts of the engine (and me with no car and no knowledge of vehicle maintenance, how'd I do with describing oil refills?). Car did not explode. That's a more accurate analogy for comparison with following directions to remove a corrupt record from a mod using TES4Edit (or TES4Gecko) instead of just using the CS (which may have been unable to remove the record due to it being corrupt). Result: game no longer crashes because of this corrupt record. Mod did not explode.
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  • 4 months later...
Necromancy mode: [quote=Giskard]I should go balistic here at the statement that Bethesda only recently found out about the navmesh bug, clearly my video was the first time they had heard about it.[/quote] You're welcome btw, Giskard, for my having brought this to their attention in a more direct - and civil - manner than you apparently attempted. [quote]Given that Gstaff has moderated, suspended or blocked me every time I made any report about anything...[/quote] This would be your own doing actually. Your abusive nature. Your attacks on nearly everyone for every conceivable reason. The flow of complaints about you were legion. It was literally you go, or loads of other people go. They chose wisely. Besides, it isn't GStaff's function there to handle bug reports. You were barking up the wrong tree. [quote]He is why my accounts are no longer usable and why I have been moderated for everything from giving a fallout scripter a compliment to reporting trolls attacking me and my website in breach of local state laws that Beth should have been enforcing automatically.[/quote] Shit like this is WHY you're gone. The moderation team did this, as you full well know, because people were sick of your shit. Your laughable insistence on this being some kind of violation of the law is probably why they decided it was best to be rid of you. In essence, they called your silly bluff and you lost. Also, for the record, this problem *IS* well known, and *WAS* reported by plenty of folks. It was never pursued as a priority before because the community found an acceptable workaround that solved it. Of course, your tool-phobia prevents you from realizing this. Those horrible evil tool makers. They kept the company from fixing the bug! Boo hoo! Er... wait... no. It was uncovered during the CK beta btw. It was reported to them before anyone knew about your video. Someone linked your video because it was convenient documentation of the issue, your snarky comments not withstanding. Is it any wonder they'd not pay attention to you when all you do is bag on them all the time? [quote]And what about the other issues and continuing troll problems, does another paying custoemr have to suffer as I did before you acknowledge a problem or do something about it ?[/quote] What problems would those be?
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He's continuing the typical stream of delusional hate-filled rants, I see. Have any of his disciples been causing problems in the mainstream community so far?
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Nope, fortunately his disciples are either laying low or are not around. I know there's at least one of them who was active on the CK forum for awhile, so he knows the truth of how the navmesh bug got brought to the forefront. Giskard's rant filled video wasn't the reason it's getting fixed.
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Word of advice Giskard, if you're going to thank me for my help, just do so. Don't toss in outright lies about trying to make a comment on my blog and claiming I'm deleting or editing them. You don't even have an account here.
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  • 2 weeks later...
I apologise for being late to the party, but I have only just been reminded of this site, and felt suitably able to contribute a useful reply free of Pro-Giskard nonsense, probably as I'd quite like to hit him if I were given the chance. They say that the gift of hindsight is usually quite beneficial, and I have to say that reading over some of the comments from the last few months, I agree with your point of view, and feel I may be able to add more in regards to his mentality. Therefore, I am posting something to amuse you, which amuses me to a point now, the rest of it makes me sneer. You may have been informed that Giskard recently started another tirade against organisations he believed to be drunk on power/totalitarian, right after he finished a recent PC-Elitist blog which triggered numerous people (some, like myself) who either left the 'Guild' or said something; I was in the latter category. I dislike PC elitism, I started gaming on the PlayStation when I was 7/8 years old, and now, nearly 12 years later, I still enjoy using the PlayStation as it is the home of my favourite game series, and I doubt that will ever change. Giskard refuses to see that there is another dimension to gaming and instead of having a debate, accuses the person of trolling and then drags their name through the mud, like he has done with mine since he decided that I had "ran out of warnings". I must confess that I don't know what he means by the above... granted, I do remember him threatening to ban me shortly before the snafu where I crossed words with Vorians on Nexus, because I used the name of my Oblivion Character, and he thought it was my name - and went mental when he realised that it was not in-fact my real name and started threatening to report me to my ISP for being a fake person (literally, [i]WTF is on my mind now[/i]) and told me that unless I proved I was a real person (read: Facebook) then I would be banned from the Guild/site and forbidden from using his mods. And of course, as this happened via Steam - which does not record the conversations, I have no proof to offer, besides the fact that I caved and told him my real name. He considers that my "first warning". It seems that he has nothing better to do sometimes than sit down and tote up a list of names with strike marks next to them... it's quite petty. Someone, a former Guild Member who, for their safety I shall not name gave this description of the Guild, which I think fits it perfectly: [quote]It seems like whenever [Giskard] is stressed, he feels the need to pick a fight with someone, so that he can call them trolls when they respond. He then plays the victim and wallows in the sympathy of his guild. I honestly think that's the primary reason he maintains his website. The mods are secondary to the mind games he plays with his userbase. If I had continued to argue with him, I would have just been giving him what he wanted. His forum is an unhealthy place, psychologically. The members there are like battered spouses, defending their abuser in hopes he won't turn his gaze upon them.[/quote] As I said above, what finally set me off his thread accusing console gamers of [url=http://www.theengineeringguild.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=338:the-pc-is-dead-guess-you-will-be-leaving-now&catid=22&Itemid=117][b]killing the PC[/b][/url], unfortunately as he does not allow comments to be shown to guests, you won't be able to see my reply, and his lack of it - that counted as a warning. I do have the screenshots however, once I find them, I don't mind submitting them. And finally, his thread of comparing the US Home Land Security Department to the Nazi SS. He doesn't like it when someone makes an open ended comment suggesting that they know a few local or not so local organisations that are similar to it. Strange considering he spends 99% of his time doing the same thing about everything he doesn't like. On that note, you have another insight into that strange mans behaviour, my user title on the site is now, as [url=http://www.theengineeringguild.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/968-my-train-was-late/]visible here[/url], is "[i]Banned for Trolling and ignoring warnings[/i]". Idiot man. I think I have a wall with more common sense than he does. And to think I once thought so highly of him, well enough to excuse his rants... I have clearly seen from reading these pages that Giskard tells more than a few porkies! And now, I'm sure, with the submission of this post that when Giskard finds out that I've been so open in voicing my opinion ([b]Free Speech is Forbidden in Giskardistan after all![/b]), that he'll order the Guild users to attack with their full arsenal. While I am sure that they are "powerful", they are nothing compared to the problems that I encountered whilst as a staff member for Travian Games. Sad thing is, there are some really, really lovely people on his site, it's just Giskard that makes the atmosphere so oppressive and negative. I remember seeing him having a go at Rites just because Rites used FCOM or Boss, or one of the tools... which I'll admit I've never used as I've never understood how to use them, and probably because half of the old blogs on the VB CMS Site was about the dangers they pose to games. Oh yes, ironically, he tried to chastise me for not using a real name, yet, he doesn't either. Poor old Brian, I think his name is apt. Brian does mean Goat, so "Old Goat" sounds appropriate. Pity. Now I've actually forgotten what point I wanted to make, yeesh, not even 20 and I've already forgotten what I wanted to say. I suppose I should just say that I am glad that I'm no longer in that atmosphere, and that I can actually join other sites now without wondering what rubbish he'd post flaming them - as is a sure-bet if a site doesn't take his rubbish, such as the official forum, and Nexus. Anyhow, I'm going to vanish back into my Tower somewhere. [b]Lord Ravenclaw[/b] [b]aka ComplexityBrit[/b]
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I'm thinking; how long will it be before Giskard comes out and attacks Nexus over its new donation system. I'm sure it gives him the perfect excuse to present the site and its users as a bunch of greedy, money grubbing dirtbags out to scam their users or something like that. With any luck it'll be more funny than outrageous as well.
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I spent last night reading Giskard's site (not his forums). First to learn about his Mages Guild mod, then to learn who this guy is exactly and what he's all about. I was unsure about what exactly the trolling was that Giskard claims to have been driven off by. I've seen trolls on the Nexus, but nothing I haven't seen before on sites that big, and the worst offenders still seem to get regularly banned. Plus the posts where he talked about his beef with all the other big mods were deleted, so I was left without knowing what this beef was. Then I read this article. Yikes. This struck me because of [url=http://www.theengineeringguild.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=333:female-gamers&catid=22:the-blog&Itemid=117]Giskard's post on women gamers[/url]. It mentioned Alienslof, who left the Nexus after being harassed. A story that, of course, Giskard believes to have happened to himself. It doesn't feel right when a victim of trolling is used as an example by an abusive person who thinks he himself is a victim of trolling. And his Mages Guild mod looked really interesting too.
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[b]@Kesidu:[/b] The Origin of the Mages Guild isn't so bad as mods go, but never, ever, try to ask Giskard for help if you have any other mods that weren't made for him installed... he then blames them. Anything by people he doesn't like, and you get banned. Its ridiculous. He hates COBL as well as any other tools/overhauls, so that's another tool off of the list. OMG has a few bugs in it as well, not that he believes it, and he just accuses you of trying to stir trouble, of messing up the mod yourself/trying to edit it, and of course, his favourite rant is about Vorians, Arthmoor and anyone who tries to "clean the mod" and that gets him so worked up he generally bans a few people for no reason, throws a wobbly and starts bemoaning everything from the weather to national debt - all of which he blames the above two people for. It'd be funny if it wasn't so pathetic.
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First off, welcome to LordRavenClaw and Kesidu. Always nice to see new folk drop by. [quote=LordRavenClaw]As I said above, what finally set me off his thread accusing console gamers of killing the PC[/quote] I can see where he might have reached a conclusion like this. Though it isn't the gamers who are killing off the PC marker. It's the vendors themselves mostly through their insistence on supporting a pair of systems with 6 year old obsolete hardware. The PC industry as a whole survives by the upgrade cycle. Cut that off, it dies. Which boils down to develop games that don't need hardware updates, nobody will bother updating. DirectX 9 is aging technology and only truly innovative houses like CD Projekt Red have been able to maximize its full potential in Witcher 2. Bethesda doesn't hold a candle to them in terms of engine development and raw graphical awesomeness. CDR develops primarily for the PC. Bethesda develops for the XBox 360. The vast differences in platforms are why PC gaming has stagnated so badly over the last 6 years. [url=http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2012/03/rumor-valve-potentially-working-on-a-steam-box-console-with-partners.ars]Valve is not helping matters either[/url]. [quote]And finally, his thread of comparing the US Home Land Security Department to the Nazi SS.[/quote] I'd certainly be curious to see that one myself. I don't much care for DHS and what they currently stand for. Though I doubt he's speaking from actual experience. [quote=Kesidu]This struck me because of Giskard's post on women gamers.[/quote] Not much the guy does surprises any of us anymore. I think most of us on the outside realize that his victim complex is one of the most epic examples. I can't help but draw comparisons between him and a cult leader with devoted followers. @prettyfly: Probably about as soon as he catches wind of it and proceeds to tell everyone how he saw this coming years ago because Vorians and I are greedy assholes only in it for the money and that we someone twisted Dark0ne's arm into going along with this :P
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I could probably get a screenshot of thst DHS thread later. I'm on my phone ATM, and have no idea hoe to screenshot on android. edit: http://i.imgur.com/Fj1Nj.png Pretty much all of ComplexityBrit's posts have been replaced with "smirk", so I only took a screenshot of the first post. Essentially, two people were refused entrance into the country because one of them said "Free this week, for quick gossip/prep before I go and destroy America?" which DHS majorly misinterpreted.
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  • 1 month later...
[quote=LordRavenclaw] I do remember him threatening to ban me shortly before the snafu where I crossed words with Vorians on Nexus, because I used the name of my Oblivion Character [/quote] That's probably my fault unfortunately. You posted on [url=http://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php?/topic/163915-reapers-arcane-university-v-4/page__st__40__p__3435890#entry3435890]Nexus[/url] as LordRavenclaw, but in my response I called you ComplexityBrit, the name you use on Giskard's site, to show you that I knew you had come from that site. Seeing that, Giskard would also have been able to link your two names together and realised you're the same person. Giskard became very upset when he first learnt that "Vorians" is also "display name is already in use" on the Beth forums. Giskard (aka The Guildmaster on his own site) does not like it when people use more than one name on different websites as it makes it harder for him to keep track of them when building up his evidence of wrong-doing to send to the police. [quote=Samson]Not much the guy does surprises any of us anymore [/quote] How about this? [b]STOP THE PRESS!!!!! GISKARD DISCOVERS THAT OFFICIAL MODDING TOOLS LEAVE BAD EDITS IN MODS, ADDING RECORDS THE MODDER NEVER EVEN TOUCHED![/b] This important new discovery which nobody before now was aware of, has been revealed by Giskard, [url=http://www.theengineeringguild.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=526:wizards-of-winterhold-v121-released&catid=7&Itemid=101]described[/url] as having "appeared in the mod as if by magic". Giskard goes on to offer the following insightful thought, that it is "interesting how cells I have not edited appear edited in Skyrims new Creation Kit." Thanks to this amazing new discovery, Giskard has benevolently written a guide on how to remove bad edits (some may consider this "cleaning" but such people are trolls and should not be listened to) titled [url=http://www.theengineeringguild.co.uk/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=528:removing-bad-edits-from-mods-the-official-way&catid=20:the-elder-scrolls-5-skyrim-modding-guides&Itemid=115]Removing bad edits from mods the Official Way.[/url] The first two paragraphs of this guide can be safely skipped as they are just a rant against trolls, the next line contradicts Giskard's standard belief system "always report these things as bugs because the best person to fix it is the modder him self" - a method attempted a few times with Giskard about 5 years ago by "trolls" such as Elminster. Of course, we should take into account that 5 years ago Giskard had not made his important new discovery that the official tools leave bad edits (not "dirty edits", that's troll-speak) and so nobody back then actually knew what they were talking about. Be warned however that his example is inaccurate. What he refers to as a bad edit (or a "dirty edit" for the trolls) is in fact not a bad edit, but rather an edit as he moved one item (probably a rock, he loves moving rocks, and then claiming that this makes the rock HIS rock so no one else is authorised to move the same rock in their mods). There is also a bemusing contradiction in the guide. First he claims that only official tools should be used to remove bad edits as official tools automatically sort out any potential errors which might arise from removing a dirty... sorry, bad edit whereas third party tools do not. He then warns that after removing a bad edit with the official tool you should check the location and do a bit of tidy up, and that the official tool may recreate what you deleted because it cannot find it any more, but give the duplicate incorrect data. So where's this automatic correction of any potential issues after removing the bad edit then?
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[quote=Samson]@prettyfly: Probably about as soon as he catches wind of it and proceeds to tell everyone how he saw this coming years ago because Vorians and I are greedy assholes only in it for the money and that we someone twisted Dark0ne's arm into going along with this[/quote] Just you, Samson, just you. I haven't enabled donations :evil: Hear that Giskard? Just him!
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