Unofficial Fallout 4 Patch & Fallout 4 VR

[Thorfkin]

I fully realize this isn't supported. Just posting to see either if anyone else has encountered this or can provide insight. Generally speaking I've found the Unofficial Fallout 4 Patch works pretty well with Fallout 4 VR. I loaded in all of the official DLCs and the UF4P like I would for the standard game. Had a few glitches here and there but for the most part I've been able to fix those with a little research and plugin editing and / or asset overrides, except for this one that has me baffled. I was on the quest to clear the ghouls from the Mass Pike Tunnel. A legendary ghoul dropped a Lucky Synth Left Arm. When I picked it up the game CTDs immediately. I assumed it must be a mod so I started disabling everything to find the source. Eventually I definitively identified UF4P as responsible. First I assumed it had to be either an incompatible asset or script. But eliminating all of the UF4P assets had no effect on the crash. The plugin contains an override for each piece of the Synth armor that adds and corrects a few keywords and changes some property values. Nothing that should cause a crash. I tried a few things to correct it. First I created a basic override plugin of my own that reverted the changes to see if that helped. No joy. Then just to confirm that those specific overrides were responsible I removed them from the UF4P entirely and discovered that cleared up the crash instantly. Some additional testing revealed that it isn't any of the changes that the UF4P did to those armor pieces that caused the crash, but the presence of the override records themselves. I was able to replicate this in a separate new plugin. I copied the Synth armor piece records as overrides into a new plugin from the originals in fallout4.esm. Confirmed even that causes the same crash, with no changes to the records at all. There seems to be something different about the way that Fallout 4 VR reads some records. Maybe a record version or something that FO4Edit doesn't do right for the VR version of the game. Has anyone else tried this and found similar results?

I'm at a loss. I was able to proceed in my game by removing those specific armor piece record overrides from the UF4P but I'm a bit bummed I had to do that. I rather liked those fixes. Now that I'm thinking about it I wish I'd kept a copy of the save in front of that ghoul for further testing.

[Arthmoor]

As you have said, we cannot provide support for the VR version of the game since Bethesda themselves do not support modding it and have said that's not possible. We can't vouch for the state of any of the records in the master files and we know that the VR version does not have identical data files. It also doesn't support the DLCs either so that's another aspect to consider. So it should be obvious there'd be nothing we can do about that.

[markthewolf90]

On 3/11/2018 at 2:04 PM, Arthmoor said:

As you have said, we cannot provide support for the VR version of the game since Bethesda themselves do not support modding it and have said that's not possible. We can't vouch for the state of any of the records in the master files and we know that the VR version does not have identical data files. It also doesn't support the DLCs either so that's another aspect to consider. So it should be obvious there'd be nothing we can do about that.

 

Funnily enough, VR mods are very easy to come by and enabling mod support for FO4VR is as simple as adding/editing a few things to the ini files. And being able to use the DLCs in FO4VR has been possible since the beginning of the year. However, I can't vouch for the records in the master files either, so that could bring up quite a bit of trouble.

[Arthmoor]

At that point you're technically pirating the DLC and that's not something we're ever going to engage with.

[markthewolf90]

On 9/27/2018 at 10:18 PM, Arthmoor said:

At that point you're technically pirating the DLC and that's not something we're ever going to engage with.

I'd hardly consider copying files from your legitimate copy of Fallout 4 to Fallout 4 VR "pirating". 

[alt3rn1ty]

1 hour ago, markthewolf90 said:

I'd hardly consider copying files from your legitimate copy of Fallout 4 to Fallout 4 VR "pirating". 

If the DLCs have not been released for the VR version of the game, then copying resources from the DLCs, or the DLCs themselves to another game (even though it is Bethesdas game it still counts as another game) falls foul of the EULA and is regarded as Piracy.

One reason I have seen mention before as an example of why :

An artist is commissioned for some of the resources in a games DLCs, and a contract is formed between Bethesda and the artist, both of whom are bound to that contract, the artist is paid, game is sold.

As far as the artist is concerned he/she was only paid for the work on resources for the original game. And not for any further versions of the game by the same company, who would be legally obliged to form another contract and more payment for the artists involved in the original, for selling the new version ( VR ) of the games DLCs and including the artists work again, before the game is re-sold as a new game.

You or anyone modding the game cannot use assets from DLCs of the original, in the new VR version if the VR version does not come with the same DLCs and resources. You are pirating content for use in another game. This is also why nobody can copy resources from Oblivion or Morrowind to become parts of a mod for newer games like Skyrim, yes the files were produced by the same games company, but they are not from the same game and all the complex contracted work legal entanglements. Bethesda allow us to modify files and resources from a game to be used in mods, so long as they are only used in the same game.

Have a look at the Morroblivion, Skyblivion and Skywind projects ( https://tesrenewal.com/ ), or the Beyond Skyrim team who recently produced the first part for public use Beyond Skyrim Bruma ( An Oblivion City recreated from scratch for Skyrim SE complete with voiced NPCs etc ) https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/10917/? - They have all taken years out of the lives of some very dedicated teams who are having to reproduce resources of their own from the ground up. If they did not, they risk being taken down by Bethesda. Meshes for giant mushrooms etc, cant just be taken from Morrowind and used in a mod for another game by Bethesda, besides looking crap versus the better quality of meshes these days, it would be against the EULA and illegal

= Piracy of resources between games even by the same company is a thing to beware.

The Unofficial Patch Project Team ( UPP ) will never endorse such practices

[markthewolf90]

10 minutes ago, alt3rn1ty said:

If the DLCs have not been released for the VR version of the game, then copying resources from the DLCs, or the DLCs themselves to another game (even though it is Bethesdas game it still counts as another game) falls foul of the EULA and is regarded as Piracy.

One reason I have seen mention before as an example of why :

An artist is commissioned for some of the resources in a games DLCs, and a contract is formed between Bethesda and the artist, both of whom are bound to that contract, the artist is paid, game is sold.

As far as the artist is concerned he/she was only paid for the work on resources for the original game. And not for any further versions of the game by the same company, who would be legally obliged to form another contract and more payment for the artists involved in the original, for selling the new version ( VR ) of the games DLCs and including the artists work again, before the game is re-sold as a new game.

You or anyone modding the game cannot use assets from DLCs of the original, in the new VR version if the VR version does not come with the same DLCs and resources. You are pirating content for use in another game. This is also why nobody can copy resources from Oblivion or Morrowind to become parts of a mod for newer games like Skyrim, yes the files were produced by the same games company, but they are not from the same game and all the complex contracted work legal entanglements. Bethesda allow us to modify files and resources from a game to be used in mods, so long as they are only used in the same game.

Have a look at the Morroblivion, Skyblivion and Skywind projects ( https://tesrenewal.com/ ), or the Beyond Skyrim team who recently produced the first part for public use Beyond Skyrim Bruma ( An Oblivion City recreated from scratch for Skyrim SE complete with voiced NPCs etc ) https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/10917/? - They have all taken years out of the lives of some very dedicated teams who are having to reproduce resources of their own from the ground up. If they did not, they risk being taken down by Bethesda. Meshes for giant mushrooms etc, cant just be taken from Morrowind and used in a mod for another game by Bethesda, besides looking crap versus the better quality of meshes these days, it would be against the EULA and illegal

= Piracy of resources between games even by the same company is a thing to beware.

Do you maybe have some citation for any of this, because the latter half of your entire reply is horribly misinformed. Those projects can't use the resources because it's illegal to re-distribute them. It has nothing to do with copying the files on their own personal desktops. As it is, the only things I can find on this topic state thar backing up copyright materials is legal, but distributing said files is illegal. I say it's nothing more than backing up files, because aa far as I know, copyright can't dictate what programs are allowed to read data in files. The EULA however is another story entirely, I'd like to get a citation for that too if you could. 

[alt3rn1ty]

If you are copying them for personal use in another game on your own machine nobody cares

Arthmoors projects and anyone elses which are distributed do need to care

Citation is in each games Creation Kit EULA

[markthewolf90]

Suppose that settles it. It's not piracy in any way, but Arthmoor isn't obligated to support it even if it's already possible and working in it's current state.